BackyardEOS crashes on download of image

[scowdich]

To get it out of the way, I'm using BYEOS premium 3.1.8 with a Canon80D. The application seems to freeze randomly on the download of an image when set to PC+Camera save (which I prefer, since it allows for image review). The application freezes, and if it was scheduled to dither, PHD2 may freeze too. The camera itself displays the number 70 on its LCD screen (and nothing else), and the camera's battery must be removed and replaced to get it functioning again. BYEOS does work without downloading (using camera-only save), but I prefer to have the image review and automatic tagging that comes with saving to the PC. A log file is attached from one of the crashed instances.

logfile-20170203-22h54m42s576-4920-2017-02-03.txt

[astroman133]

When you described your symptoms I wondered if your PC was a low-powered PC like a netbook.

 

If you plug a USB 2 cable into a USB 3 jack, the data transfer will be at USB 2 speed, but internally it will use a different USB hub. I expect that it will cure your issue if you split your traffic by using both ports..

[JTWaters]

scowdich - I ran a much older release of BYE and PHD 1.x from my Dual Core Atom Toshiba Netbook for years without any issues.  I also had TheSky 6 running.  I have posted several lockup problems with the 3.1.8 release and I still get occasional lockups.  These occur with or without PHD Guide 2 running.  I recently tried to reduce PHD Guide 2 sample times from 1 sec to 5 and I got a lockup over the weekend.  I do run through a powered USB 2 Hub.  IMHO there's a problem with this release. 

[admin]

scowdich - I ran a much older release of BYE and PHD 1.x from my Dual Core Atom Toshiba Netbook for years without any issues.  I also had TheSky 6 running.  I have posted several lockup problems with the 3.1.8 release and I still get occasional lockups.  These occur with or without PHD Guide 2 running.  I recently tried to reduce PHD Guide 2 sample times from 1 sec to 5 and I got a lockup over the weekend.  I do run through a powered USB 2 Hub.  IMHO there's a problem with this release. 

 

I doubt.  His issues are caused by a camera Err70.  Nothing software can do if the camera itself throws an error.  Until this is resolve there no one can make that claim.  

 

Jim, did I ever review your log files?  I can't remember.  

 

Regards,

[astroman133]

Also, Jim, what model of camera and which SDK are you using when you get a lockup?

 

Depending on which camera you are using, you can select more than one SDK. For example, with my T5i I can use either the Canon or the Canon215 SDK. If your camera is not too new you may be able to try a different version of the Canon SDK to see if that works around your issue.

[JTWaters]

guyroch - I emailed the full log files and also extracted the error messages and posted them.  You did review the extracted messages and said these aren't causing my problems.

 

astroman133 - I am using the Canon 6D with FW release 1.1.7.  I do occasionally get lockup errors with my T3i.

 

How can I select the SDK?

[JTWaters]

How can I select the SDK? - I figured this out.  Thx

[scowdich]

I'm pleased to report that removing the card and setting the camera to shoot without a card inserted seems to have solved my problem - I had hours of uninterrupted imaging. There was a camera glitch when I went to take my flats which required resetting the camera (by removing and reinserting the battery), but I'll take one error at the end of the night over a repeated half-dozen.

[astroman133]

You may be overloading the USB hub. The hub may be an external hub or built-in to the PC. If you are not using an external hub, try plugging the cable from PHD and the cable from the 80D into jacks on opposite sides of the computer.  You could also try taking "throw away" images without running PHD to see if the camera behaves better.

 

Also, I am not sure of the benefit of saving the images to the camera's memory card, unless you will be processing them on a separate PC and are using the memory card for transport. That works and is convenient, but if you use the images from the camera rather than the images that BYE has downloaded you give up the descriptive file names from BYE and the additional metadata that BYE adds to the images, which can be used by some stacking programs. Just my 2 cents.

[admin]

As Rick, you are putting to much on a single usb cable at once. 

 

Plug the camera directly in a computer USB port, do you still get the issue?

[scowdich]

Thank you for your replies - unfortunately, I'm not using a USB hub, both the camera and the guide camera are plugged into separate USB ports on the computer itself. This also occurs when not guiding, as I've had this freeze happen when taking dark frames. Could it be that the download is just too much for my netbook to handle?

[admin]

How old is your laptop?  Is the USB port 1.1, 2.0, or 3.0?

[admin]

Does the 80D have 2 SD card slots?

 

If you try to save to PC only do you have the same issue?

[scowdich]

My netbook has one USB 2 and one USB 3 slot - I've been using the 2.0 slot out of habit, I'll try the 3.0 slot next time. The 80D has only one card slot. I haven't tried saving to PC only, but I can give it a shot - maybe it's time to run some bias frames...

[scowdich]

Changing to the USB 3.0 port seems to have solved the issue - I just took 100 bias frames without a hitch. Fingers crossed that this doesn't cause any issues with guiding, since it'll have to settle for the 2.0 port now.

[admin]

Changing to the USB 3.0 port seems to have solved the issue - I just took 100 bias frames without a hitch. Fingers crossed that this doesn't cause any issues with guiding, since it'll have to settle for the 2.0 port now.

 

Then this seems to confirm a usb data saturation issue; let me explain.

 

Do you have another USB device plugged into your computer?  A USB mouse?  USB Keyboard? USB Webcam? USB anything, etc...

 

If yes and if one of those devices is 1.1 device then the 2.0 USB internal bus will drop to 1.1 speed for all devices.  

 

This is not the case for USB 3.0.  The 3.0 internal bus will negotiate the proper speed for each devices and those needing 3.0 speed will operate at 3.0 speed, those needing 2.0 speed will operate at 2.0 speed.  I suspect this is what is happening here.

[scowdich]

The only other USB device I usually have plugged in is my guiding camera (Orion StarShoot camera). The computer only has two USB ports, a 2.0 and a 3.0. Maybe some internal connection in the netbook is USB, like the keyboard or touchpad. In any case, it seems to be working now, but the real test will be my next imaging session.

[scowdich]

Unfortunately, the problem doesn't appear to be totally resolved - the camera froze again (figuratively) while I was taking some dark frames. Canon's official documentation is little help:

Err 70: Description: A malfunction with the images has been detected.

Resolution: Turn the power off, then remove and re-install the battery. Then turn the power on again.

That's pretty much what I've been doing already...further research online indicates I could have a memory card problem, or worse, a systemic problem with the camera. Hopefully I won't have to send it in for service. Thanks for your help.

[s3igell]

Can you confirm whether this same Error is ever encountered when you Save to PC Only??

 

While you could have an issue with your SD Card, you could also be experiencing some issue between the 80D's Firmware and the Canon SDK.

[admin]

Ah, just time you mention Err70.  Were you getting this error initially as well?

[admin]

To expand on what s3igell said... I would even remove the card and set the camera to take pictures without a card, then use save to PC only in BYE and see what happens.

[scowdich]

Err70 was the error I was getting the whole time - sorry I neglected to describe it properly earlier. This has occurred when saving to PC only. I'll give shooting without a card a try when my next imaging opportunity rolls around.

[astroman133]

Or try a different card.

 

Do you see any errors when shooting untethered?

[scowdich]

I've tried a different card, no joy. I didn't encounter this problem before shooting tethered, but I'd really like to continue using BYEOS - the temperature logging and comprehensive tagging (plus other features) are very valuable to me. I'd definitely like to get this sorted out before the eclipse, so I can use BYEOS to automate my capture plan...

[s3igell]

Err70 was the error I was getting the whole time - sorry I neglected to describe it properly earlier. This has occurred when saving to PC only. I'll give shooting without a card a try when my next imaging opportunity rolls around.

Don't waste Good Imaging Opportunities trying to resolve this issue.  Just set up your 80D with it's USB Cable on the Kitchen Table, and test while drinking your coffee.  You'll want to add your Guiding Camera and it's USB Cable too - if this truly ONLY Occurs when BOTH are Connected.  (Did you determine whether this Occurs with ONLY the 80D Connected??)

[astroman133]

It could just be overloading your netbook. The BYE license allows you to install it onto multiple PCs, as long as you only use 1 copy at a time. One way to eliminate your camera/memory card as the problem would be to install BYE on a faster PC, like a desktop, to see if you can re-create the issue.

 

s3igell is correct. You should be able to duplicate your issue at the kitchen table. It will be especially easy if the symptoms occur with only the 80D connected to the netbook.

 

Over the years there have been several people who have had problems when trying to do astrophotography with a netbook. Many of them ended up purchasing a more powerful laptop.

[scowdich]

This does occur with only the 80D connected. Before my next imaging session I'll try shooting cardless - no such thing as too many bias and dark frames. I'd rather not have to get a more powerful laptop, the netbook's battery life is great.

[astroman133]

I understand. That is why I suggested testing on another, faster PC. If the problem still occurs then you know that the netbook is not the culprit.

 

I use a power hungry 17" laptop with 8GB memory and a 1 TB SSD. In the field I do not rely on the laptop battery. I power the laptop from a deep cycle car/truck battery.

 

I should also say that BYE is in pretty wide use and most people use it without issue. The vast majority of issues are pilot error, Windows security issues, or cabling (usually bad cable or cable too long). Also in there are a few cases of malfunctioning cameras. The software is reliable and a great tool for DSLR image capture.