BYE with Canon 6DMkII and mirror lock-up

[BackyardRLK]

I am using BYE with a Canon 6D Mk II and generally it seems to work fine (tested in Imaging only so far), but the mirror lock-up delay feature of BYE does not appear to work.  BYE just ignores the delay value that is set.  Has anyone succeeded in getting this to work with this camera body?  If I actually turn MLU ON in the camera's settings, then BYE does not work.  It starts to capture images (ignoring the MLU delay parameter), but the circular progress bar goes round and round without ever stoping and downloading the image.  I have to turn the camera off to get out of the loop.

Thank you,

Richard

[astroman133]

I tried to duplicate your issue with BYE 3.1.16 and my T5i. It did not matter whether Mirror Lockup was enabled or disabled in the camera's Custom Functions menu. BYE is able to change the Mirror Lockup setting as defined in my Capture Plan.

Which version of BYE are you using? Are you using an autofocus lens or a telescope when you experience the issue?

The good news is that Mirror Lockup is not particularly useful when doing long duration photography of DSO's or when using LiveView for frame and focus or for planetary capture.

[BackyardRLK]

Thank you for your response.  I have the latest version of BYE (as of a couple of days ago), so I assume 3.1.16 (I'll double check.)  When I did these tests, I had a camera lens attached to the body.  I tested in AF and manual focus mode.  You questions prompt me to test it with the body alone.  I'll try that next.

I recognize that a few seconds of vibration at the beginning of a multi-minute exposure won't matter much, but I can imagine taking short exposures of the moon using BYE and would like to have the option.

Richard

[s3igell]

For Lunar Images, you'll probably get Sharper results if you use Planetary Imaging Mode and stacking the results with AutoStakkert3 or RegiStax6.

But, the Mass of your 6DmkII and (one assumes) 200L f/4 or f/2.8 will do an amazing job at dampening any Mirror Slap in any case.

 

[astroman133]

Richard,

One way to test how much vibration is caused by the mirror is to take some undithered images while autoguiding and see if the guiding is upset when the mirror flips up. I would not expect to see much of any effect, whatsoever.

I also agree with s3igell about using planetary mode for shooting the moon. The best lunar image that I did was a 6-panel mosaic of the moon using BYE's Planetary imaging mode at 5X zoom. Each panel was stacked from 800 frames by RegiStax and the 6 results were combined with RegiStar. To shoot the 6 panels I just moved the zoom box around and did not need to move the mount at all..

[BackyardRLK]

Thank you for the good suggestions.  I'll follow up.

Richard

[Alexey Popov]

Hello! 

I have exactly the same problem with mirror lock with a brand new 6D Mark II. With 700D in the same time its works properly, its completely ok.  

BYE is 3.1.16, EOS utility 3 (last version). Virtual Mirrow Lock in BYE is switched off (has no influence at all, really), in camera mirrow lock switched on. 

What I can add to descriptions: it looks like after I press Preview button in BYE camera just stand in lock up a mirror mode, but it does not shoot. Counter goes round and round and downloading does not start. But if I press a shoot button on the camera - it makes shot and BYE gets a photo.   

And whats important also: In EOS Utility with remote shooting I have to press shoot button two times! As far as I remember with on 700D it works with one click. And even when I shoot by camera itself I have to press shoot button on camera two times! This is a different behavior definitely, because on 700D I had Mirrow lock function enabled always, forever. On 6D Mark II I have to switch it off for the normal shooting... 

 

[admin]

Canon changed how the mirror lock property is accessed in some higher-end models; I can't access it properly and therefor I can't read it or set it... so it simply does not work with the 6D Mk II as of now.  I've looked at it a couple of times and I have not been able to get it too work to date.

Regards,

[Alexey Popov]

May be just disable Mirror lock function for 6D Mk II in BYE for the time being...

Or make a remark in cameras compatibility list. Or after camera connection.  

[astroman133]

Does BYE's Virtual Mirror Lock function work for the 6D Mk II?

I am sure that Guylain is trying hard not to have model-specific code in BYE. By that I mean if the camera is the 6D Mk II then do this otherwise do something else. It will get to be a nightmare to maintain and test, especially with the very large list of supported models.

[Alexey Popov]

2 minutes ago, astroman133 said:

Does BYE's Virtual Mirror Lock function work for the 6D Mk II?

No, it does not. Simply do nothing. 

3 minutes ago, astroman133 said:

I am sure that Guylain is trying hard not to have model-specific code in BYE. By that I mean if the camera is the 6D Mk II then do this otherwise do something else. It will get to be a nightmare to maintain and test, especially with the very large list of supported models.

Do nothing is worse - its my opinion. Its a new model and more and more people will be faced with such behavior. But small remarks in camera list do nothing with code. And small check and warning message "on your model mirror lock does not work" connection established or when user specified mirror lock duration - not a big challenge. 

OK, guys, I gave you feedback - do what you want to do. If you need my help with testing when you find a way - let me know. My current setup is heavy and stable enough, so I guess I do not need this feature anymore. 

By the way, APT does not shoot at all :)) Simply repeat error message "set the camera in dial mode M". Probably, it was better for me to buy old 6D model

[astroman133]

Alexey,

I don't disagree with your suggestion. Having model-specific messages displayed and/or written to the log file would be useful to users to understand BYE's behavior. They would tend to prevent support requests and lead to an improved user experience. I was just trying to suggest why the developers might have chosen to not display such messages.

Please add your suggestion as a new post in the Feature Suggestion Box Forum. That way it will be seen and commented on by other users who may also have cameras with features that are not supported by the Canon SDK and so are not available to BYE.

Canon provides the SDK on an unsupported basis so there is no official channel for users and 3rd party developers to provide feedback. Still they seem to discover those rare shortcomings and bugs that happen to be released. Perhaps MLU for the 6D Mk II will be supported in a future SDK release.

[admin]

Virtual Mirrol Lock uses live live mirror up so this should work with any models that has live view.

Set ML off in the camera and see if this works with Virtual ML.

Regards,

[Alexey Popov]

4 hours ago, admin said:

Virtual Mirrol Lock uses live live mirror up so this should work with any models that has live view.

Set ML off in the camera and see if this works with Virtual ML.

Does not work. Simply start shot without mirror lock delay.

[admin]

Even with ML off in the camera itself?  Odd.

If this is the case send me the logfile with ML off and a Virtual Mirror Lock image that fails.

[Alexey Popov]

Attached. 

Mirror lock in camera is switched off. I made a few shots without mirror lock and after that I switched on Virtual Mirror lock, set 3 sec Mirror lock delay and made a shot. 

 

 

logfile-[20180310-12h00m02s436]-[9692]-2018-03-10.txt

[Alexey Popov]

The main problem with camera Mirror lock is that it aborts very slow. The abort function works with huge delay. The counter is in the Busy state and its rounding and rounding... And you have to wait..

The log file with such behavior is attached. 

logfile-[20180310-12h29m04s968]-[4704]-2018-03-10.txt

[Alexey Popov]

And another one but similar problem. I connect camera through Wi-Fi. It works good, just slow. But last evening I had a problems time to time. Preview worked OK, focusing mode - OK, planetary - OK, etc. But when I made a shot (RAW+L) sometimes its take too much time for downloading and I got a timeout error after 59 seconds. I lost image but also I have counter in Busy state which I can`t abort so I had to close application. 

Logs attached. Search for "timeout" keyword.

logs.7z

[Alexey Popov]

And the last one... Sometimes you incorrectly determine current shooting mode. Its stays always in M mode, but sometime BYE determines it as a Tv mode. EOS Tools in the same moment determines mode correctly. Solution is to change mode on camera, e.g. from M to Av and back to M. 

[Alexey Popov]

Hm... Camera Mirror lock works perfect in APT! The key is that you have to work in B (Bulb) mode, instead of M (Manual) mode. At least APT requires changing mode to Bulb and after that it works. 

[astroman133]

OK, so Mirror Lock works in APT when the shooting mode is BULB, but not in Manual. What about BYE. If they both use the Canon EOS SDK to control the camera, then they should both work the same.

If the camera must be in BULB for MLU to work that is indeed unfortunate since if MLU is necessary it will be for shorter exposures. The shortest BULB exposure that is possible is 1 second.

Please try native (not Virtual) mirror lock with BYE when shooting in BULB mode and let us know the result.

[Alexey Popov]

Really strange... 

Switch on camera, connect to BYE - Manual mode. Switch on Mirror Lock on camera, make a shot (does not work), finished manually by fire button on camera. And after shot BYE shows me B-status! But real status on camera - M. 

[Alexey Popov]

In B-mode BYE does not work with camera Mirror Lock again. The same behavior, absolutely. After shot I hear sound like mirror is up, but the counter start to count shot, instead of mirror delay. It counts exactly same seconds I specified in shutter field. Many seconds later I hear sound like mirror down. But BYE still is rounding in BUSY mode... Then I get a error in BYE (downloading timeout). And in this situations its not possible to abort it! You have to close BYE, and this is a bug, definitely.

 

[astroman133]

Guylain probably knows for sure, but for some of the newer cameras with separate BULB and Manual modes it may be possible for BYE to override the shooting mode. This may be why BYE and the camera show different modes.

[Alexey Popov]

Again have a M-mode instead of B-mode in BYE after start... 

In B-mode with camera Mirror Lock switched off and Virtual Mirror lock switched on it makes a shot but simply without mirror lock delay. 

[Alexey Popov]

2 minutes ago, astroman133 said:

Guylain probably knows for sure, but for some of the newer cameras with separate BULB and Manual modes it may be possible for BYE to override the shooting mode. This may be why BYE and the camera show different modes.

Sometimes I have Tv mode instead of M mode... 

[admin]

Looks like Ivo was able to figure out the ML using the SDK in APT... with little documentation from Canon this is a hit and miss for us.

Without ML (or virtual mirror lock) does the camera work fine with BYE?

 

[astroman133]

I wonder if BYE needs to programmatically activate the shutter twice with your camera. Once to raise mirror and again to start the exposure.

I changed my mind on this one. After looking at what is available via the SDK. It does not seem as though it is possible to read or set the Mirror Lock property. This makes me even more curious to know how APT is able to handle this.

[admin]

Just now, astroman133 said:

I wonder if BYE needs to programmatically activate the shutter twice with your camera. Once to raise mirror and again to start the exposure.

 

Yep, this is what is required for ML... with a small pause in between.  For some model the pause needs to be longer, something between 0.2 and 1 second usually works.

The issue with this model is reading the ML property ON/OFF.  BYE, with it's current method, can't read it and therefor is unaware that ML in ON... so it will not issue the second shutter activation of ML.

The fact that BYE can't read it is obviously a bug in BYE... I'll try to address this for sure in later releases... but without a physical camera on hand it is difficult to fix.  It is one of those bugs.

Regards,

[Alexey Popov]

What is really inconvenient in the last version - it resets all settings in capture plan line when you set 0 in Exposures column. The problem is that sometimes you do it accidentally, just entering a new quantity. It happens for a few seconds buts its enough. For instance, I have 100 shots and I starting edit this value. As soon as I delete 1 - the line has been reset. You can say that its not so dangerous.. But first of all, I have to remember about that all time.. Second, really bad - in the night, in a hurry, you can miss this reset, start shooting and will be very unset later... I lost a few hours already...

[Alexey Popov]

18 minutes ago, admin said:

Without ML (or virtual mirror lock) does the camera work fine with BYE?

Without ML it works good. I shot a few nights and it was good. 

I found one more problem only, while camera was connected through Wi-Fi with timeout during image downloading. Again, main problem that this operation can`t be processed automatically - it was not possible to abort it. If it happens during automatic shooting without me in front of laptop - I lost some hours again. This problem prevents of using Wi-Fi, too bad... See above, there are logs attached to my post.